oil additive may have toasted my engine

Discussion in 'General Motoring' started by marks89lebaron, Mar 27, 2005.

  1. I have an 89 lebaron with about 80k. Lifter noise was bothersone so I
    added RISLONE engine treatment, mainly because I heard that RISLONE was
    one of the best at "quieting noisy engine lifters". In fact,
    lifter-noise-taming is what the product seems to mainly endorse, although
    the label does mention that it will "remove sludge and other harmful
    deposit". So well in fact that its' detergent properties were powerful
    enough to release enough sludge on an 80,000 mile motor to block essential
    ports, resulting in ?? amount of engine damage. At any rate, the fact that
    previous owners of the car may have been lazy about proper auto.
    maintenance, as well as the fact that RISLONE seems to "under-emphasize"
    it's products' ability to break-up sludge in a car's engine, has left me
    stuck picking up the pieces but hey, thats' life, right? I have, however
    played with idea that, in the event the engines' oil ports were
    free-flowing once again, the engine might not sound so sickly when I crank
    it over and actually run again (how well, who knows?) Does anyone have any
    suggestions on how to "un-block" the oil ports on a non-running 2.2L
    chrysler engine, in case luck may be on my side?
     
    marks89lebaron, Mar 27, 2005
    #1
  2. marks89lebaron

    Treeline Guest

    I toasted something adding in Bardahl's for a smoking engine, I do believe.
    You have my sympathies. I don' tknow about RISLONE. I forget what I
    toasted. The catalytic convertor, is that possible? The car really went
    downhill after some of that anti-smoking sludge. So I did the opposite
    of what you did. I sludged mine up. A big Olds I had, probably similar
    in engine type, a big 80's V-8 back then, about same mileage as yours.
     
    Treeline, Mar 27, 2005
    #2
  3. I don't think you had lifter noise at all. I think you probably had the
    beginning of gudgeon pin (piston pin) knock, which is very common on
    earlier 2.2 and 2.5 litre engines. Those cam followers scarcely ever make
    noise.

    Adding anything other than the specified oil to your crankcase is risky
    business on an engine an unknown or known-to-be-poor maintenance history.
    Even on an engine in fundamentally sound condition, flushing operations
    are fraught with exactly the hazard you encountered.
    And unless I miss my guess, you just poured it right on in, probably on
    top of a crankcase full of dirty oil and an old filter, figuring you'd let
    it do its thing for awhile and then change the oil sometime in the
    future...right? This is practically guaranteed to result in exactly what
    happened to you. An engine dirty enough to require flushing really needs
    to be opened and cleaned (at least the oil pan and cam cover removed and
    manually cleaned), but if you're determined to try a flush, you start by
    buying several oil filters and a lot of new oil.
    Its entirely possible to accumulate fatal amounts of sludge in far less
    than 80k miles if low quality oil and filters are used and/or if the oil
    is not changed often enough.
    Certainly seems so.
    Er...huh? It says it dissolves gum and sludge. Where did you think the gum
    and sludge would go? It doesn't just de-materialize or otherwise
    disappear, y'know...
    Well, let's have the rest of the story. You added the Rislone, you ran the
    engine, and then...what happened, exactly?
     
    Daniel J. Stern, Mar 27, 2005
    #3
  4. marks89lebaron

    HarryS Guest

    Pulling the head is the only way if it is not running and brushing out the
    ports. I have used a product called Marvel Mystery oil it comes in a red
    can and most places carry it. Drain out all oil, fill 1 quart shy and add 1
    quart of MMO fun engine for about 30 minutes at idle, drain oil, change
    filter and refill with oil, run another 30 minutes check oil condition if
    dirty change oil and filter. This stuff really cleans your engines innards.

    --
    HarryS My 2ยข
    |I have an 89 lebaron with about 80k. Lifter noise was bothersone so I
    | added RISLONE engine treatment, mainly because I heard that RISLONE was
    | one of the best at "quieting noisy engine lifters". In fact,
    | lifter-noise-taming is what the product seems to mainly endorse, although
    | the label does mention that it will "remove sludge and other harmful
    | deposit". So well in fact that its' detergent properties were powerful
    | enough to release enough sludge on an 80,000 mile motor to block essential
    | ports, resulting in ?? amount of engine damage. At any rate, the fact
    that
    | previous owners of the car may have been lazy about proper auto.
    | maintenance, as well as the fact that RISLONE seems to "under-emphasize"
    | it's products' ability to break-up sludge in a car's engine, has left me
    | stuck picking up the pieces but hey, thats' life, right? I have, however
    | played with idea that, in the event the engines' oil ports were
    | free-flowing once again, the engine might not sound so sickly when I crank
    | it over and actually run again (how well, who knows?) Does anyone have
    any
    | suggestions on how to "un-block" the oil ports on a non-running 2.2L
    | chrysler engine, in case luck may be on my side?
    |
     
    HarryS, Mar 27, 2005
    #4
  5. AND INSTALL NEW FILTER!
    fast idle
     
    Daniel J. Stern, Mar 27, 2005
    #5
  6. marks89lebaron

    Bill Putney Guest

    Was this the type of Rislone that you put in for a quick 15 minute
    cleanout, or something you put in an leave in?

    Bill Putney
    (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
    adddress with the letter 'x')
     
    Bill Putney, Mar 28, 2005
    #6
  7. marks89lebaron

    Richard Guest

    Just change the oil at least twice in short order. Dan's suggestions are
    sound. Good detergent oil will get out any solids in short order with far
    less risk of too much too soon. Additives are not needed.

    Richard.
     
    Richard, Mar 28, 2005
    #7
  8. Don't believe I've seen one of the 15 (or 5) minute "fast flush" engine
    enemas with the Rislone label on it...
     
    Daniel J. Stern, Mar 28, 2005
    #8
  9. marks89lebaron

    Bill Putney Guest

    In the "old days", that's what a Rislone flush was - I guess at some
    point they wisely changed the product, of which I wasn't aware.

    Bill Putney
    (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
    adddress with the letter 'x')
     
    Bill Putney, Mar 28, 2005
    #9
  10. marks89lebaron

    Guest Guest

    As far back as I can remember Shaler Rislone was available 2 ways - in
    the quart and 1/2 pint (more or less) sizes. One was to add in a
    change, the other to a full crankcase. The quart was basically a can
    of oil with the concentrate already mixed in.

    It was a rather "gentle" engine flush compared to most. I have used
    cases of it over the years, without a problem.
    If an engine is particularly badly gummed up I would not leave it in
    for more than a few hundred miles of driving. I've had a few where it
    could not clean the engine up enough to eliminate valve noises. If the
    oil can't flow in the first place, the rislone can't clean out the
    passages. A 351C (or M - can't remember which) on an old LTD was one I
    remember that kept eating rockers untill I replaced all the push-rods
    and pulled and hot-tanked the heads. (surprisingly, the crankcase was
    pretty clean by then)

    An old Rambler 232 did not respond either, so I ran a peice of brake
    line from the oil sender switch port up to the rocker shaft. The
    overhead oiler quieted that engine down and I was able to drive it
    until I didn't need it any more, without a squeak or clatter. (on that
    engine the oil comes up around one of the head bolts that was so badly
    coked and sludged I was not willing to risk trying to remove it)
    Within weeks of installing the Rislone and oil line the rocker shafts
    were clean and varnish-free.
     
    Guest, Mar 28, 2005
    #10
  11. As far back as I have seen it advertised (at least as far back as the mid
    '60s), it's always been the same as it is now: A thin oil containing a
    dose of detergent chemistry. The fast-flush gookums are made out of active
    solvents and/or Butyl Cellosolve.
     
    Daniel J. Stern, Mar 28, 2005
    #11
  12. marks89lebaron

    Brian O Guest

    Not sure about this, but in the past I've run diesel fuel in the crank case
    for about a minute to flush it. I don't recommend it by any means because I
    always thought it was dangerous.
    B
     
    Brian O, Apr 3, 2005
    #12
  13. marks89lebaron

    Bill Putney Guest

    What I call "sudden flushes" like that are not advisable if there is
    significant sludge. People who do those are taking a big risk with the
    engine. A gentle, controlled cleanout is less likely to cause
    catastrophic engine faliure.

    Bill Putney
    (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
    adddress with the letter 'x')
     
    Bill Putney, Apr 3, 2005
    #13
  14. marks89lebaron

    Guest Guest

    Deisel, or Kerosene, is MUCH better than harsher solvents like varsol,
    as it does not dry up the sludge turning it into "clinkers".
    The only sludged engines I have had fail (after me working on them)
    were my brothers old Vauxhaul (which we did nothing to, other than
    change the oil and drive) and his '65 valiant slant 6, which we did
    not flush - but we DID chip out a lot of crud to get to the valve
    adjusters. We though we got most of it out, but obviously enough crap
    stayed loose in the engine to block the oil pump pickup screen (dead
    in less than 10 miles).
    I have used Kero (and deisel, and stove oil), ATF, rislone, various
    engine flush products, and never had a problem with any of them in
    over 35 years.
     
    Guest, Apr 7, 2005
    #14
  15. marks89lebaron

    Treeline Guest

    That's the first I ever heard of anyone killing the venerable, a moment
    of silence here, for the great, tank-like, slant 6. Kudos!

    I tried, 300,000 miles. Nothing could kill that engine for me.
    The body would rot away. Leaving the engine still going but
    hard to drive a car when the body and other necessary parts
    start to rot. The odometer would just keep turning over,
    100,000 miles here and there, starts to add up after a while.
     
    Treeline, Apr 7, 2005
    #15
  16. marks89lebaron

    Joe Guest

    Me too, I thought they'd run without oil pressure. Eventually you just have
    to give up trying to wear them out, or maybe get in a wreck.
     
    Joe, Apr 8, 2005
    #16
  17. marks89lebaron

    Guest Guest

    I don't think the previous owner had ever changed the oil - and after
    a bit better than a year of driving with noisy valves brother decided
    he wanted me to adjust the valves. Could hardly find the rocker arms.
    Didn't have any flush fluids around, so we decided to drive it back to
    town and flush it the next day. Didn't get back to town before the oil
    light came on and a main bearing spun.
    Pulled the engine and the pickup screen was totally plugged.
    Big brother bought a new car, and little brother "inherited" the
    Valiant and rebuilt it while he was going to high-school. He put on a
    2 barrel, split exhaust manifold, and a bunch of other toys trying to
    make it go better than my old Dart and Valiant had gone. I was out of
    the country when he got it back on the road, and he had sold it by the
    time I returned - so I only have hearsay evidence that says it was
    perhaps a little faster than mine - and had a lot more bottom end.
    Used to have burnout contests with his buddies with 304 gremlins, and
    apparently did quite well.
    I personally never got rid of one with less than 100,000 miles on the
    clock (usually bought them just shy of the 100,000 and drove them
    another 3 or 4 years)
    The "leaning tower of power" was a great engine and responded well to
    tuning (204HP @ 6250 RPM 170 cu inch)
     
    Guest, Apr 9, 2005
    #17
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