Need info on plants to be sold by DC

[no-one-here]

I just heard that DaimlerChrysler is selling the Huntsville
Electronics plant to Siemens which is another German company. My
source says it will happen next month, in January 2004.
Rumor also has it that 1/3 of the employees at the Huntsville plant
will be cut when they move the radio and instrument cluster production
to Mexico.

There have been rumors for several years that this plant would be sold
but apparently the silly Germans are dumb enough to finally do it.
When that plant sells it should raise the cost of these components at
least 20% since there will be another middle man to collect profits.
Although this is a significant price increase this will be nothing to
what will happen in 5 to 10 years when the new car designers will
specify new sub assembly parts that can not be made by low cost
processes since there will be no one left in Chrysler by that time
that knows how to manufacture that type of subassembly to tell the new
car designers what the cost risers are for the new sub assemblies.
The suppliers will supply what is specified. If you think not just
look at how the US government operates buying $500 hammers when you
can go to the local hardware store and buy a hammer, almost, but not
quite like it for $10. ( It is not good for a supplier to tell their
customer that they are stupid! )

You only have to look at what happened to AMC when they became "only"
a final assembly plant for other’s parts to see the future of
Chrysler. In my opinion they are going to get what they asked for but
it sure is not going to be what they want long term!
I hope I am wrong since I have several Chrysler cars and I would like
to have a source of parts in the future.

Does anyone have more information on what plants will be sold by
DaimlerChrysler and when?

 

[Art Begun]

Toyota buys its automatic transmissions from a contractor in Virginia.
They are probably one of the most reliable AT's in the business. Out
sourcing is how the industry works.

 

[Ted Mittelstaedt]

Toyota buys its automatic transmissions from a contractor in Virginia.
They are probably one of the most reliable AT's in the business. Out
sourcing is how the industry works.

The original poster was not complaining about outsourcing. He quite
obviously is
a fan of outsourcing - when it comes to a German manufacturer outsourcing
it's
electronics manufacturing to the US, that is.

Rather the original poster was complaining about the move of jobs from the
US
to Mexico, which is a valid issue.

In Toyota's case, they buy from the US because the US Government makes it
expensive for
them to completely manufacture their cars in Japan. If the government
wasn't interfering
in the auto business and forcing foreign companies to outsource
manufacturing here,
it's unlikely that any of them, including the "domestic" manufacturers,
would be doing
any manufacturing in the US at all.

The fundamental problem is that Chrysler is no longer a "domestic" company,
and new
Chrysler autos are rapidly becoming little different than any other foreign
imports.

Ted

 

[Tbone]

I just heard that DaimlerChrysler is selling the Huntsville
Electronics plant to Siemens which is another German company. My
source says it will happen next month, in January 2004.
Rumor also has it that 1/3 of the employees at the Huntsville plant
will be cut when they move the radio and instrument cluster production
to Mexico.

Gee, Corporate exec's screwing employees and the nation to raise stock
values for a quarter or so and get a bigger bonus, imagine that.

There have been rumors for several years that this plant would be sold
but apparently the silly Germans are dumb enough to finally do it.
When that plant sells it should raise the cost of these components at
least 20% since there will be another middle man to collect profits.

LOL, if you are going to make this argument, at least be realistic about it.
DC is not going to do anything that it knows is going to make its cars MORE
expensive to build. In Mexico, they pay there employees 30 dollars a day,
not an hour like in America. Then you can add the reduced costs of not
worrying about any insurance or pollution regulations and even with the
added middle man, it will cost a lot less. What they do fail to see is all
the people they and others like them lay off become that many less potential
customers because they can't afford to buy them anymore.

Although this is a significant price increase this will be nothing to
what will happen in 5 to 10 years when the new car designers will
specify new sub assembly parts that can not be made by low cost
processes since there will be no one left in Chrysler by that time
that knows how to manufacture that type of subassembly to tell the new
car designers what the cost risers are for the new sub assemblies.
The suppliers will supply what is specified.

LOL, do you think that because DC sells off an electronics plant that
everyone that runs the company is going to become stupid??? Unless DC
decides to stop development and the building of cars for the next 5 to 10
years, how is this even possible???? This makes no sense and looks to me
like this argument is just a BS way of discrediting the real argument
against doing this.

If you think not just
look at how the US government operates buying $500 hammers when you
can go to the local hardware store and buy a hammer, almost, but not
quite like it for $10. ( It is not good for a supplier to tell their
customer that they are stupid! )

LOL, I think that you may want to do a little research into the cause and
reason for the $100 hammers before bringing that up.

You only have to look at what happened to AMC when they became "only"
a final assembly plant for other's parts to see the future of
Chrysler.

No, AMC died because (with the exception of Jeep) they built a bunch of ugly
cars that nobody wanted.

In my opinion they are going to get what they asked for but
it sure is not going to be what they want long term!

Yes they will and YES THEY DID. They bought Chrysler for its rapid design
capabilities and they got them. If the Chrysler division winds up folding,
they still got what they wanted most and if they can make it profitable,
then that is just extra icing on top of the cake.

Does anyone have more information on what plants will be sold by
DaimlerChrysler and when?

If they cannot turn a good profit soon, I would say ALL OF THEM.

 

[beekeep]

I just heard that DaimlerChrysler is selling the Huntsville
Electronics plant to Siemens which is another German company. My
source says it will happen next month, in January 2004.
Rumor also has it that 1/3 of the employees at the Huntsville plant
will be cut when they move the radio and instrument cluster production
to Mexico.

There have been rumors for several years that this plant would be sold
but apparently the silly Germans are dumb enough to finally do it.

I don't think the term "silly" applies to corporate raiders. When the
German's get done raping Chryco they will have made quite a profit.
Who can blame them, after all, it's the American way.

beekeep

 

[Mike Hall]

Some Chrysler products have actually gotten better since using German
technology and parts, so the union of the two companies in that respect has
done Chrysler a favor.. Chrysler has been the poor relation in US auto
manufacturing for quite a while.. nobody seemed to care whether Chrysler
lived or died at one time.. the way things were, the company was going to
fold at some point, and jobs would be lost.. so?.. Daimler Benz joins
Chrysler and, in an attempt to save the name and the product, do whatever is
necessary.. did anybody notice Ford or GM rushing to save the Chrysler brand
and american jobs?.. why should they?.. Chrysler was competition of sorts..
Daimler Benz took a hit too.. their US assembled products lacked the quality
and reliability of Euro built products.. same for BMW in this respect..

Re. the movement of plants to outside of the US, this is a worlwide problem
where manufacturing has had to find a cheaper base to compete with other
makers in the field.. consumers want the best deal available to them.. they
don't care if the dash assembly was put together in Huntsville or Tijuana..
as long as the damn thing works and is cheap, do you think that they really
care?..

 

[Art Begun]

Mercedes E class are some of the least reliable cars made. Same with
the S and M. (Made a funny.)

 

[Pete]

Pres Clinton only helped other this country lose more jobs by signing the
NAFTA bill which made it cheaper to take businesses out of the US and build
stuff in other countries.

 

[Art Begun]

Clinton plus Republicans in Congress.

Pres Clinton only helped other this country lose more jobs by signing the
NAFTA bill which made it cheaper to take businesses out of the US and build
stuff in other countries.



about cars see is
all bunch of
ugly

 

[Tbone]

I think that you need to get your time lines correct. Chrysler went into
the hole and came back strong long before Daimler bought them out.

 

[Art Begun]

Actually it was just some fancy accounting to make themselves look
good. They reduced the reserve for warranty work and therefore that
money became profit. Their second generation LH cars really never did
as well as expected and their cars take too long to assemble compared
to more profitable makes.

 

[Mike Hall]

If Chrysler had been as strong as you like to think they were, DB would not
have been able to get a foothold.. Chrysler products are subject to numerous
recalls, and many do not trust their products to be anything close to
reliable.. they are not out of the hole yet.. crash testing has not served
Chrysler too well in the past either.. I have a '94 Chrysler Jeep Grand
Cherokee that I am pleased with.. it has not let me down badly yet,
certainly not as bad as some have reported.. it is my hope that DC make it..
I would much sooner have a Chrysler/DC product than Ford or GM, and would
like to stay with a North American make on the basis that it would be easier
to get it fixed.. so who cares if the CEO is not an all-american kid.. it is
not in DC's interest to wind down the whole of Chrysler, but they do have to
make it profitable.. if that means the closure of some plants, so be it.. of
course that is tough on the people that work them, but maybe, just maybe,
Chrysler will come out above Ford and GM one day.. at that point, people
here will be whining about closure of Ford and GM plant closures no doubt,
and they won't be able to blame Germans directly for it..

 

[Tbone]

If Chrysler had been as strong as you like to think they were, DB would not
have been able to get a foothold.

If it was as weak as you claim, Daimler would not have had to lie and claim
it as a merger of equals. Chrysler was bought out due to weak leadership
and typical American greed. Did Chrysler do any of this crap when they
bought AMC, no.

Chrysler products are subject to numerous
recalls, and many do not trust their products to be anything close to
reliable..

Yet more BS. GM has far more recalls than Chrysler ever did. Then lets not
forget about the Pinto.

they are not out of the hole yet..

No, they are fallign back into it.

crash testing has not served Chrysler too well in the past either..

The same could be said for ALL American makes at the time.

I have a '94 Chrysler Jeep Grand
Cherokee that I am pleased with.. it has not let me down badly yet,
certainly not as bad as some have reported.. it is my hope that DC make

it..

What are you talking about?

I would much sooner have a Chrysler/DC product than Ford or GM, and would
like to stay with a North American make on the basis that it would be easier
to get it fixed..

You had better get something straight, it is now a German make. Most Hondas
are now built right here in the US.

so who cares if the CEO is not an all-american kid..

There is much more to it than that. The technology that creates those cars
and the profits from it are also not American any more. Hell, the whole
damn company is no longer an American one.

it is not in DC's interest to wind down the whole of Chrysler, but they do have to
make it profitable..

While true, their primary reason for buying Chrysler was not to take over
the production lines.

if that means the closure of some plants, so be it.. of
course that is tough on the people that work them, but maybe, just maybe,
Chrysler will come out above Ford and GM one day..

And this will help the people that lost their jobs or the US economy
how????????

at that point, people
here will be whining about closure of Ford and GM plant closures no doubt,
and they won't be able to blame Germans directly for it..

Ford and GM are already closing plants.

 

[MoPar Man]

While true, their primary reason for buying Chrysler was not to
take over the production lines.

Brings up this point: Why did Daimler merge/buy Chrysler? Certainly
not to have an additional car line to sell in Europe (Daimler execs
repeatedly "dodge" the question as to why they have little or no
interest in marketing Chrysler vehicles in Europe - let alone
Germany).

Just what manufacturing capacity does Daimler/Merc have in the US
anyways?

 

[Mike Hall]

The Chrysler Neon was marketed in the UK, but has not been sucessful.. also
the Chrysler Voyager, which after crash testing was written off as junk..

 

[MoPar Man]

The Chrysler Neon was marketed in the UK, but has not been
sucessful.. also the Chrysler Voyager, which after crash testing
was written off as junk..

During 1/2 dozen business trips to Germany / NL in the past 2-3 years
I see very very very few American cars in parking lots and on the
road. I remember specifically seeing a handful of 300M's (and I
smiled each time I saw one). Saw a PT Cruiser in Berlin late last
year.

I don't think that the larger vehicles made in the US (vans,
mini-vans, pickup trucks) are right for the EU market, but certainly
the sedans (of all sizes except for stuff like a crown-vic) would not
be out-of-place there. I think there's a reluctance on Daimler's part
to sell Mopar cars in Germany/EU for reasons that anyone has yet to
voice. I think there's an internal struggle within Daimler to give
Chrysler vehicles more exposure in EU, which will get worse as the US
dollar sinks vs the Euro and Daimler continues to throws away the
profit potential of selling Chrysler in EU.

 

[Daniel J. Stern]

The Chrysler Neon was marketed in the UK, but has not been sucessful.. also
the Chrysler Voyager, which after crash testing was written off as junk..

Gee, that's funny...the last two times I've visited Europe, there have
been '89 and later Chrysler Voyagers *all over* the place. The common
rail turbodiesel/5-speed combo (not available in North America) is
particularly popular.

DS

 

[Daniel J. Stern]

Why did Daimler merge/buy Chrysler?

Because they saw Chrysler repeatedly bring concept cars to market in
record time and figured that by assimilating Chrysler, they could speed up
their own frozen-molasses speed of innovation. Unfortunately for them,
virtually every last bit of the engineering and design talent that powered
Chrysler jumped ship at or shortly after the takeover.

It's interesting to note the similarities between Daimler-Benz and the
Borg.

Just what manufacturing capacity does Daimler/Merc have in the US
anyways?

M-klasse SUVs are made in America.

DS

 

[MoPar Man]

Because they saw Chrysler repeatedly bring concept cars to market
in record time and figured that by assimilating Chrysler, they
could speed up their own frozen-molasses speed of innovation.

And that explains why they swept the year-2000 Hemi-C concept under
the rug never to be seen again? And the Charger concept also shown at
the 2000 Detroit auto show?

Unfortunately for them, virtually every last bit of the
engineering and design talent that powered Chrysler jumped
ship at or shortly after the takeover.

While that sounds romantic, and it might be true, and there is even
reason to believe it is true, can anyone point to any exodus of design
or styling talent from Chrysler? Anything published by any automotive
rag along those lines?

It's interesting to note the similarities between Daimler-Benz
and the Borg.

Yea well like I said you're not seeing Chryslers turning up in Europe
because of this merger. If there was an assimilation, it's hard to
understand what Daimler intended to happen with Chrysler's
physical-plant, engineers, market share, etc.

 

[Daniel J. Stern]

And that explains why they swept the year-2000 Hemi-C concept under
the rug never to be seen again? And the Charger concept also shown at
the 2000 Detroit auto show?

Nonsequitur. Read what I wrote again, more carefully this time.

While that sounds romantic, and it might be true, and there is even
reason to believe it is true, can anyone point to any exodus of design
or styling talent from Chrysler?

Yep. Bob Lutz is one of a *great* many.

Anything published by any automotive rag along those lines?

"Automotive News", yes, but I don't expect you read industry publications
-- you strike me as more of a "Consumer Reports" guy, or maybe "Car and
Driver"...someone who likes magazines that do his thinking for him.

Yea well like I said you're not seeing Chryslers turning up in Europe
because of this merger.

Another nonsequitur.

If there was an assimilation

...."if"?

DS