Greater percentage of wrecked cars being scrapped rather than repaired

Discussion in 'General Motoring' started by Geoff, Jul 22, 2004.

  1. Geoff

    Geoff Guest

    This from the WSJ, via the site:
    Car accidents are becoming more costly and as a result, The Wall Street
    Journal reports, more vehicles are being scrapped instead of repaired. The
    paper says this year thus far, 16 percent of vehicles involved in collisions
    are being scrapped, up from just 7 percent in 1995. Part of the problem is
    the increasing technology baked into vehicles like Jaguar's X and Audi's A8
    aluminum-bodied cars with expensive and specialized repair needs. Airbags,
    too, are causing more catastrophic damage to the interiors of cars,
    resulting in high repair bills. Even headlamps - multiple beam xenon lamps
    in particular - are far more expensive to repair than plain old halogens.<<

    I've got to believe that this jump in total losses is having a big effect on
    car insurance rates. Again, I ask why don't the car companies come out with
    vastly simpler models? Wouldn't it be more profitable for everyone
    concerned if you could still actually get something like a Hemi-equipped LX
    car devoid of the electronic doodads for around, say, $20-25K? Cheaper to
    buy, cheaper to insure, cheaper to repair. Probably longer-lived, too. Or
    does everyone really *want* to have the processing power of a 1970s
    datacenter embedded in their dashboard, and I'm the odd one out?

    Serious question.
    Geoff, Jul 22, 2004
  2. Geoff

    Art Guest

    Computers which enable anti lock brakes and stability control reduce
    accidents and insurance costs. Also the biggest part of insurance is still
    liability and airbags saves lives which reduce liability costs so the heck
    with the interior of the car.
    Art, Jul 22, 2004
  3. What damage, besides killing smaller occupants, are airbags causing?
    They do cost an arm and a leg to replace. I wonder if that is the
    catastrophic damage they are referring to.
    They build what people buy.
    I think your average new car has much more computing power than a datacenter
    from the 70's.
    Alex Rodriguez, Jul 22, 2004
  4. Air bags don't save lives. Seat belts do. Air bags may lessen injuries,
    but they don't save lives. Some air bags also kill.
    Alex Rodriguez, Jul 22, 2004
  5. Except that insurance companies have been scrapping ABS discounts for
    years now, since they *don't* reduce insurance claims.
    Except that airbags *take* and *damage* lives, too.
    Daniel J. Stern, Jul 22, 2004
  6. Yep! Art Begun's ignorant parrotting notwithstanding, you are correct.
    Ever sat in on a focus group?
    There're at least three of us (I'll let Mister Three nominate himself if
    he so chooses).
    Daniel J. Stern, Jul 22, 2004
  7. Geoff

    Art Guest

    ABS doesn't reduce insurance claims because people don't know how to use ABS
    The multi stage airbags should reduce airbag related injuries. In tests,
    side curtain cars do far better protecting passengers than identical cars
    without side curtains. Yes, Dan there are exceptions when the curtain is
    poorly designed and does not protect the head adequately. I think it was a
    Art, Jul 22, 2004
  8. Geoff

    Lisa Horton Guest

    Just call me miss Four :)

    Lisa Horton, Jul 22, 2004
  9. Geoff

    Art Guest

    Well I guess you guys don't believe the insurance industry crash test
    Art, Jul 22, 2004
  10. Geoff

    Art Guest

    Independent insurance industry crash test results don't have any
    significance to you Dan?
    Art, Jul 22, 2004
  11. Geoff

    Guest Guest

    I'll respectfully dissagree here.

    Yes, airbags can reduce the severity of injuries in that low
    percentage of accidents where serious injury DOES occur. However, the
    high cost of damage to vehicle interiors is incurred EVERY time the
    air bag fires. The air bag fires, the majority of times, in incidents
    (I won't call them accidents) that would be survived either injury
    free or with minor injury if the occupants are wearing properly
    adjusted seat belts.
    EVERY air bag deployment costs large dollars, while only a small
    mumber of incidents would involve serious injury without.
    Also, air bags can CAUSE serious injury in cases where non air-bag
    equipped vehicles would be safe.

    Vehicle repair costs are a very real part of the reason for increasing
    insurance costs.

    Lawyers and outright fraud are a larger part of the increase in
    insurance premiums than real medical costs.

    The fraud artistes are well known to the authorities, but due to the
    lawyers, attempting to convict them immediately gets characterized as
    "racial profiling" so both the cops and the insurance companies let
    them continue pulling their scams.
    Guest, Jul 22, 2004
  12. Geoff

    Guest Guest

    Complete instrument panel disintegration, windsheild damage, just for
    Hit a curb at 10MPH with a late model Cavalier, and the interior
    damage excedes the suspension damage by a factor of something like 3:1
    No. people buy what companies sell. Smoke, mirrors, and all.
    Yes, much more than some early 80's main frames.
    Guest, Jul 22, 2004
  13. Geoff

    Art Guest

    In NC insurance rates have been remarkably stable.

    By the way my father just got rid of a 87 Camry with only liability
    insurance and replaced it with a Saturn L300 Wagon which costs about $25k.
    New Saturn has full comprehensive and $250 deductible on collision. His
    insurance cost only went up $200 per year. I had to ask twice.
    Art, Jul 22, 2004
  14. Geoff

    Art Guest

    You are ignoring the fact that today people are routinely walking away from
    35 mph crashes without a scratch. In the old days it would mean major
    hospitalization and insurance costs. A opthamologist friend noticed the
    trend in the late 80's when calls for emergency eye surgery from car
    accidents started to fall.

    Art, Jul 22, 2004
  15. Geoff

    Neil Nelson Guest

    Which (time wise) also happens to coincide with states writing
    compulsory seat belt laws.
    Neil Nelson, Jul 22, 2004
  16. Geoff

    Lisa Horton Guest

    I'm all for airbags and other safety features. But wouldn't it be
    possible to implement those kinds of features without quite as much in
    the way of electronics and computers?

    I've recently read articles about celphones and car accidents, and some
    studies are showing that other distractions, including the new
    "telematics", are also major contributors to distraction and accidents.

    Then again, I'm one of those few people who will answer the phone in the
    car with "I'm sorry, I'm in the car, I'll call you back as soon as I'm
    not driving" :)

    Lisa Horton, Jul 22, 2004
  17. -Windshield
    -Dashboard assembly
    -Sometimes side glass
    -Often steering wheel

    All frequently destroyed or damaged beyond re-use in a bag deployment. And
    that's without counting the airbags themselves.
    And people buy what they build. C'mon, now, did anyone *demand* $100 car
    Daniel J. Stern, Jul 22, 2004
  18. Thank you. We agree.
    Should, but don't.
    Daniel J. Stern, Jul 22, 2004
  19. Art, I "guess" you're right. I believe data accumulated from real-world
    traffic crashes.
    Daniel J. Stern, Jul 22, 2004
  20. Which you seem to want to credit solely to airbags.

    I know it's very hard for you, but *try* sticking to topics you know at
    least a little bit about. That way you won't look like such a goof.
    Daniel J. Stern, Jul 22, 2004
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