Advice needed to remove seized bolts.

Discussion in 'General Motoring' started by pawn, Sep 4, 2005.

  1. pawn

    pawn Guest

    Hi!

    I'm trying to replace worn out bushings for the rear track bar on my '95
    Grand Cherokee. Geez, was a torx type bolt really the best choice for a
    heavy bolt completely exposed to road salt, etc.?

    Anyway, I'm about out of ideas. I've only attempted to remove the
    passenger side bolt (attached to the frame rails, not the axle). I
    haven't (completely) stripped the torx bolt head, but enough that it
    will never come loose through conventional means. I have used liquid
    wrench, spent considerable time cleaning the threads of the bolt,
    various types of mechanical persuasion. I'm not comfortable with using
    any method of heating the bolt due to the the proximity of the gas tank
    and brake lines.

    I gave up after trying to weld a torx bit directly to the bolt head, but
    the bit's steel is just too hardened to get any penetration with my
    little mig.

    What would the experts do in such a situation? Torch off the bolt on
    the nut side and start anew? I wouldn't do this myself, for the reason
    mentioned above (not to mention, there is a steel shell around the bolt
    on the axle side, making this a very difficult task for someone using
    jack stands).
     
    pawn, Sep 4, 2005
    #1
  2. pawn

    Walter Guest

    What usually works for me is spraying it with some kind of penetrant ...
    liquid wrench used to be the best stuff for me ... now it's something
    called "p b blaster" or something like that. I personally think the
    stuff is awesome. Try turning the bolt out after letting it soak in for
    a few minutes.

    If that doesn't work and you strip it, a punch will almost always work
    (if you can get it in there) with a hammer. You need a pointed punch.
    Make a small indentation in the bolt's head and then try using the
    hammer and punch on an angle to break the bolt loose. Once it's loose,
    put a set of vice grips on it and turn it the rest of the way out.
    Doing it this way will require you to buy a new bolt, but you were going
    to have to buy one, anyway.

    If neither of those work, you might end up having to grind the head off
    the bolt and use an easy out .... and if that doesn't work, take it
    somewhere and let someone else deal with it. :)
     
    Walter, Sep 4, 2005
    #2
  3. pawn

    pawn Guest

    I should have mentioned the bolt is fairly inaccessible (only through a
    small window of space), making grinding off the head very difficult (I
    doubt I could get even my 4.5" angle grinder on it). Maybe a drill or
    dremel with a grinding bit?

    Exactly what I'm thinking, I just really hate admitting defeat on this.
     
    pawn, Sep 4, 2005
    #3
  4. pawn

    Walter Guest

    Sometimes admitting defeat is the best thing you can do ... at least in
    terms of time and money. We'd all like to win every encounter,
    especially with a bolt or screw ... but if it's going to take 2 weeks, x
    number of broken tools, etc etc ... we may as well pay some garage (or
    the dealer) a few hundred bucks to take care of the problem (and have
    someone to blame if they don't do it right).
     
    Walter, Sep 5, 2005
    #4
  5. pawn

    Sarge Guest

    Walter wrote: "Sometimes admitting defeat is the best thing you can do ...
    at least in terms of time and money. We'd all like to win every encounter,
    especially with a bolt or screw ... but if it's going to take 2 weeks, x
    number of broken tools, etc etc ... we may as well pay some garage (or the
    dealer) a few hundred bucks to take care of the problem (and have someone to
    blame if they don't do it right)."

    Boy mechanics just love people that try to repair something and can't. That
    is why I try not to admit defeat.

    Sarge
     
    Sarge, Sep 5, 2005
    #5
  6. pawn

    Walter Guest

    This is true, too. I guess there are no easy answers. :(
     
    Walter, Sep 5, 2005
    #6
  7. OK, this is an instance where your going to have to drill out the bolt.

    You see, the head was too deteriorated that even if you had exactly the
    right size
    torx, and used the correct breaker bar, the amount of force needed to break
    free
    the bolt is higher than the remaining steel in the head can take.

    If you could get a grinder in there and there was enough clearance, you
    could
    grind the bolt head hexagontal, then use a standard 6 point socket.

    Otherwise if it's recessed, you will have to drill it out. I would advise
    against an
    easy-out or other screw extractor, it will probably break off and leave
    behind
    a hardended biit of steel that you can't drill out.

    Use a drill bit that is exactly the size of the diameter of the deep part of
    th threads and if your very careful you will end up drilling straight down
    the
    center of the bolt, then you can chase out the threads with a tap.

    Otherwise you will not end up going straight down and will impact the
    threads
    the bolt is in, then have to drill oversize and install a helicoil.

    Ted
     
    Ted Mittelstaedt, Sep 5, 2005
    #7
  8. pawn

    Bill Putney Guest

    Amen. Last fall I went to replace the thermostat in my 2.7L engine. I
    had heard it was a bear, but that's never prevented me from doing "the
    impossible" before. However, I did surrender on that one - started and
    realized I couldn't finish it - closed her up and took it to a shop I
    use. Ended up paying them over $350 - and that was with me supplying
    the parts. The shop told me they gave me a break on the price, and I
    believe them - and I was glad to pay the $350. I'm 54 years old. A 44
    year old me *probably* would have persevered and got 'er done, but I did
    surrender on that one.

    Bill Putney
    (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
    address with the letter 'x')
     
    Bill Putney, Sep 5, 2005
    #8
  9. pawn

    tim bur Guest

    insteasd of welding a hardened tool to the bolt why not weld a nut to the
    head of the bolt it works a whole lot better
     
    tim bur, Sep 5, 2005
    #9
  10. pawn

    pawn Guest

    Great idea! I'll go at this again today. It's either the grinder or
    this idea.

    Thanks for all of the responses.

    KJ
     
    pawn, Sep 5, 2005
    #10
  11. Start by using a decent penetrating liquid, not liquid wrench or WD-40. I
    have had good results using P-Blaster.
     
    Alex Rodriguez, Sep 19, 2005
    #11
  12. If you use a dremel, plan on spending a long time trying to grind off the
    bolt head.
    If you have the time, you can try different methods. If you don't have the
    time, you should try to get someone else with a lot more experience to give
    it shot.
     
    Alex Rodriguez, Sep 19, 2005
    #12
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