300M suspension (what's the likely cause of knocking, cost to repair,etc)

My '00 300m has just turned 100k (km) or 62k miles (vast majority in
city driving). I guess that's about 10k miles per year. Some
significant periods were spent driving over road sections that were
undergoing lengthy re-construction. Over time I've been
noticing/feeling increasing knocking coming from the front end.
Driving for a few months with a badly warped front rotor(s) I'm sure
didn't help.

So while the steering still seems very tight, the knocking has to do
with driving over un-even pavement, dips, etc. It's not really
noticable unless you pay keen attention (it can be hard to separate it
from general road noise). While I'm familliar with and have worked on
late 1960's C-body suspension and early 70's B-body suspension, I'm
not familliar at all with the suspension configuration of a 300M.

What is the most likely suspension part(s) that is wear-prone that is
probably causing this knocking? Ball Joint? And what does a dealer
typically charge to replace it/them ?

 

--

Actually the ball joints have been outstanding, your problem sounds like the
sway bar links are worn out. Off hand I would guess $200 parts, 1.0 labor to
install. but you should get it checked out before just putting parts on it.

My opinion
Glenn Beasley
Chrysler Tech

 

I would agree with what Glenn said, but would add that also worn out
sway bar bushings will cause the same exact symptoms. The auto parts
stores have good aftermarket parts - TRW and or Moog end links ($20 to
$40 each) and bushings ($10/pair IIRC). About 2-3 hours total to
replace all of them for the DIY'er.

For the bushings, there are two different sizes of sway bars and
bushings on the LH cars - would be best to measure the actual diameter
of the sway bar before going to the parts store. Have the dimension in
both inches and metric (measure in one, then convert inches to mm by
multiplying by 25.4, or divide by 25.4 to go from mm to inches).

Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')

 

How about $15 in parts and the Chrysler dealer will know which ones fit your
car so you don't need to get dirty before you begin. Should take about 1/2
hour to replace both and all you might want to do is raise the front of the
car slightly (ramps are preferred because dangling the wheels is not a
natural attitude for the suspension parts and may actually frustrate your
work) to get to the bolts.

If this doesn't work and you have no clear reason to think it's something
else, move out to the end links. You'll get a good idea how tight, or
loose, they are when you have the bushings out. Just because they're not
providing much resistance, shouldn't be construed as worn out. If, however,
one end or the other is just plain sloppy you'll know where to go next.
These should be about $35 each aftermarket (O'Reilly's or similar).

Bob in Liberty

 

Use the group page of www.google.com to search this group for the word
"clunk". You will find an interesting history of my dealer experiences
trying to get a clunk out of a 99 300M.

 

Except the aftermarket bushings last a lot longer. However you could
have the dealer look up to see which sway bar and bushings you have so
you know whether to get the larger- or smaller-holed bushings. If you
have access to the parts list, like thru the 300M Club or something, you
can see whether that part number is the larger or smaller sway bar
(i.e., for standard or heavy-duty suspension).

Probably optimistic - the bolts are hard to turn (interference fit) and
long - a lot of hard wrench twisting, and probably not enough room to
get powerful enough air tools in there. I estimate a good hour, hour
and a half, start to finish for the two bushings.

The bushing bracket bolts would be very hard to get to with the wheels
in the way - you need a straight shot into the bushing area to get to
those bolts, so the wheels need to come off. The bolts are made to be
interference fit to the nuts, and it takes a lot of torque to get them
in and out. Using ramps, the wheels will definitely be totally in the
way and frustrate you. Having both wheels hanging down relieves the
sway bar stress - it's only when one wheel is up and the other down that
you have problems due to stress being transferred into the bushings and
end links while you are trying to remove/install them.

 

Yes Art, I've been reading those as they were posted.

I'm going to assume for the moment that my issue is sway-bar related.
We'll see.

Yesterday I bought (from Canada Tire) a sway bar link kit - identical
to what Bill Putney was showing here:

http://300mclub.100megs42.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=8050&sid=c56a1bbcb884a4428e3778d67d73257d

Mine is the TRW unit (no grease fitting). I think it was $36 (CDN, or
about $31 USD).

I was also going to pick up one of those Chilton's (or what-ever)
books on the 300m, but Crappy Tire didn't have anybooks on the newer
LHS cars (post-1997). I guess there's not much "do-it-yourself" being
done on those cars to warrant them to carry it.

I have no idea where the thing I bought is located (or if the car has
just one, or two of them) but when I get the car jacked up and have a
look I suppose I'll be able to spot it easy enough.

 

Likely. If not the end links (the parts you just bought), then sway bar
bushings - easy to install and about $10 for the pair.

You can get instant gratification by purchasing an on-line subscription
specific to your vehicle (using the VIN) thru www.alldata.com - $25 for
first vehicle, first year, $15 for any additional vehicles or annual
renewals. Info. is better than Chiltons because it is right out of the
FSM, includes all schematics - again, specific to your vehicle. Plus
you get access to all TSB's for you car with the subscription.

There are two - one behind each front wheel - oriented vertically - one
end attaches to sway bar, other end to the strut - can't miss them once
you remove the front wheels. Jack both front sides of car up at the
same time and remove front wheels. Jacking only one wheel up at a time
will put stress on the sway bar and make it difficult/impossible for you
to get the links on and off.

Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')

 

LOL!

Art, I was just thinking of your situation. It seems you were the first and
appears, not the last, to get this problem. So, is this what I can expect
:-(

Ken

--
"Now Phoebe Snow direct can go
from thirty-third to Buffalo.
From Broadway bright the tubes run right
Into the Road of Anthracite"
Erie - Lackawanna

 

Stabilizer bar end-links are the usual culprits on LH cars. other
possibilities are tie-rod ends, lower ball joints, and the McPherson
strut bearings at the top of the strut (not too commonly a problem).

Stabilizer bar end-links are trivially easy on those cars- you really
should do them yourself before taking it in to a front-end shop for work.

 

As well as sway bar bushings.

For what the end links cost ($20-40 each x 2), you might as well spend
an additional $10 on a pair of aftermarket bushings and replace them
while you have the car jacked up and the wheels off for the end links.

IMO...

Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')

 

Bill,

You're right. It's been a few years since I worked on my (now long gone)
300M so I pulled the Haynes down off the shelf and peaked at Chapter 10.
Great picture on 10-9 showing the bolts. They definitely do go down from
the top.

I probably put mine on jack stands and pulled the wheels to get them out of
the but I don't remeber it being a difficult job at all. Probably spent
more time messing with elevating the car and pulling the wheels than
ermoving the retainers.

Oh, anyone who wants to Paypal me $10 can have the low-mileage Haynes #25026
to which I referred. It claims to cover 1998 thru 2000 models (and probably
more of the LH platform LHS, 300M, Concorde and Intrepid).

I might have the VHS mentioned on other posts if someone is really
interested. I'd have to root around a bit, but it's probably here
somewhere.

Bob
Liberty MO